Peugeot 406 Coupe EV conversion

Talk about the 406's electrical system, what wires do what, how to add extra functionality, etc.

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Welly
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Re: Peugeot 406 Coupe EV conversion

Post by Welly » Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:09 pm

Brilliant work!

Your engineering and electronics skills are amazing!

I particularly admire your work overcoming the difficulties with the auto gear box, air con, power steering, vacuum, speedometer - you have some determination there.
Cars in my care:

2005 Volvo S40 T5 German Diesel botherer with new tyre grippage
2010 Citroen C4 1.6 HDi turbo de' explosions, bizarre gearbox model
2010 Renner Twingo refreshingly simple

arber333
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Re: Peugeot 406 Coupe EV conversion

Post by arber333 » Thu Aug 08, 2019 9:25 pm

Yeah i must not let a car mess with my plans... 8)

I think AC wont start because BSI thinks the car is low on coolant, which it is. I will have to route the cooling system hoses and connect the reservoir.
I cant see RPM indication anywhere in the AC logic.

I still have a backup plan for RPM indicator. I will just use one small 12V electric motor and make one 60 slot wheel with optical sensor with last 3 slots cut out. I will run it at 800rpm as soon as i apply start pin. This should make BSI think the car is idling.

EDIT: Well again i stand corrected. I rigged cooling system and tried to fill it up. Sure, coolant level sensor went out. AC however still wont start. DOH!
Now i see an additional problem of "Engine over temperature" error comming up. Not a huge problem except system starts cooling fans as soon as i remove key!!! Huh, i would expect it to try to cool down the engine immediately.

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Re: Peugeot 406 Coupe EV conversion

Post by arber333 » Mon Aug 26, 2019 6:55 pm

Does anyone know why car would say "engine temperature too high" even thouogh i have coolant sensor attached and it is operating?

tnx

A

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Re: Peugeot 406 Coupe EV conversion

Post by steve_earwig » Tue Aug 27, 2019 7:37 am

Not sure which engine you had, think you said ES8J4S but if it was an ES8J4 then it had 2 temperature sensors - one for the display, one for the ecu.
Unskilled meddling sin©e 2007

2004 D9 2.0 HDi 110 Estate lhd VF38ERHZF81657352 - sold but being very well looked after.
1991 Yamaha TDM850 - fuel leaks galore!
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Re: Peugeot 406 Coupe EV conversion

Post by arber333 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 7:48 am

steve_earwig wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 7:37 am
Not sure which engine you had, think you said ES8J4S but if it was an ES8J4 then it had 2 temperature sensors - one for the display, one for the ecu.
I had ES9J4S engine 210BHp inside. So that means there has to be another sensor, because the indication one is actually working. Can you tell me, or better yet send me a drawing of the other sensor location? And its P/N?
I tried to find it on the engine actually, but i cant. Maybe i already removed it unintentionally.

tnx

Arber

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Re: Peugeot 406 Coupe EV conversion

Post by steve_earwig » Tue Aug 27, 2019 8:39 am

No, you were right - if it's the later engine then the diagram only shows 1 sensor, just it was my first thought when I read your post as we'd seen problems with the 2 sensors not agreeing in the past.
Unskilled meddling sin©e 2007

2004 D9 2.0 HDi 110 Estate lhd VF38ERHZF81657352 - sold but being very well looked after.
1991 Yamaha TDM850 - fuel leaks galore!
2008 Toyota Recall4 2.0 VVTI ATM LHD JTMBH31V90D007261 - flimsy piece of crap.
1953 Matchless G3LS - It's alive!!

arber333
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Re: Peugeot 406 Coupe EV conversion

Post by arber333 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 8:44 am

steve_earwig wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 8:39 am
No, you were right - if it's the later engine then the diagram only shows 1 sensor, just it was my first thought when I read your post as we'd seen problems with the 2 sensors not agreeing in the past.
Is it possible that i damaged the sensor when i was preparing a socket for it on my coolant manifold? It still shows temperature swing if i heat it up.
Is oil level + temp probe significant here? I pulled it out and connected it to wiring loom but there is no difference.
Also i see oil sensor is 4 pin connector, but my wiring papers show only 3pin connection?

A

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Re: Peugeot 406 Coupe EV conversion

Post by arber333 » Tue Oct 01, 2019 4:39 pm

Well i am humbled again...
I let the car wait for some time and delt with electronics. Now when i came back to it i tried various sensors Also i made arduino circuit to simulate engine RPM with 60 - 2 pulses. I connected its output to one RPM sensor wire and tada!!! A relay went on inside cooling fan control and alarm stopped.
When i tried the other wire i got same result. What is interesting is that with this signal RPM dial doesnt show anything. It must be missing the negative side of the signal. I should build push-pull transistor pair to make both sides of the signal.

A

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Re: Peugeot 406 Coupe EV conversion

Post by arber333 » Wed Oct 23, 2019 11:48 am

Well f***k RPM indicator. I started to assemble the car without it operating for now.
Speedo bill be enough information for now. Also AT computer will translate my Drive/Reverse command to display on dash. I will have only ABS to resolve since it obviously takes some RPM signal from BSM. Everything else works!

So i hope i will have a working car by next month.

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Re: Peugeot 406 Coupe EV conversion

Post by steve_earwig » Wed Oct 23, 2019 8:58 pm

Wow, that's some progress! That'll be a majr achievement to get it on the road, you can sort out the mere details later.
Unskilled meddling sin©e 2007

2004 D9 2.0 HDi 110 Estate lhd VF38ERHZF81657352 - sold but being very well looked after.
1991 Yamaha TDM850 - fuel leaks galore!
2008 Toyota Recall4 2.0 VVTI ATM LHD JTMBH31V90D007261 - flimsy piece of crap.
1953 Matchless G3LS - It's alive!!

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Re: Peugeot 406 Coupe EV conversion

Post by frog » Fri Oct 25, 2019 7:36 am

arber333 wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2019 11:48 am
Well f***k RPM indicator. I started to assemble the car without it operating for now.
I was thinking you might have blown up some circuit in the engine ECU.

I attached page 36-37 of the big "Bosch Motronic ME7.4.6" encyclopedia (you already have it in full). The pages show how the crankshaft position sensor works. Looks like it is a passive sensor, so probably a voltage is applied to the sensor by the ECU itself on one of the pins (e.g. +, pin E2 in the 48-way black connector) then readout is done on the other (e.g. - pin E3). If you now apply external voltage on these pins, there are two voltage sources competing, so this may blow up either or both of the supplying circuits...

So i hope i will have a working car by next month.
Good progress! Keep us updated! I am in desparate need for pictures :wink:
Current "fleet":
2003 406 Estate 2.0HDi 110 - 7 seater
2001 Citroen Saxo 1.6i 8v 100

Previously owned:
2000 406 Sedan 2.0 HDi 90
2000 406 Coupé 2.0i 16v 138 - Riviera Blue

PP2000 user, can help with faults / diagnostics in the Netherlands.

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Re: Peugeot 406 Coupe EV conversion

Post by arber333 » Sat Oct 26, 2019 11:09 am

Thanks Frog for detailed description. I really need the info on why or how something works in the 406.

I think circuit works though, since when i attach RPM sensor and bring some metal close circuit reacts and some relays inside cooling fan relays start.
The same happens if i apply some open collector 5V signal from Arduino pins. Do you think i should use 12V instead, in your document it says 5V is minimum so what if arduino gives 4.9V? DOH! I will use 12V with NPN then. I didnt think of that since when i test the sensor it gives a short +/-1.5V differential pulse on the scope. That should be enough to open one transistor on the other side.
Hm... do you think sensor is also grounded to chassis? That would explain why no RPM since i didnt connect it anywhere near chassis.

EDIT: Oh pics are on my blog https://leafdriveblog.wordpress.com/
It is a bit difficult to post pics here since there is a limit of 300kb on attachments....

EDIT2: i just gave it open collector 12V. It wont show anything on the dial. I will have to try with diff voltage signal.
However on the speedo i figured i need division by 6 e.g. the driveshaft will rotate at 50km/h and if i use single magnet on sensor i will get 420Hz signal. Well speedo to show 50km/h needs 67Hz only! That is 6.2 divider. I will need some divide by 6 circuit.

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